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Post by gyrocog on Jun 2, 2010 19:35:35 GMT
You can't compare the two. Windows Vista/7 have different ways of handling audio than XP. Now, with Windows 7 + ASIO, onboard audio, such as Realtek, SoundMax, etc, can only serve ONE application at the time, so if you have winamp/mediaPlayer or whatever started and you run an app that uses ASIO, it will report output as unavailable. And if you run app+ASIO first, no other application will be able to produce any sound (ie. you won't hear anything coming from winamp/mediaPlayer/youtube/etc). For that to work, apparently you need a sound card that's able to serve multiple clients.
Apart from having that issue as well on Win7 x64 (using 32-bit DAW), I don't need anything extra, like extremely low latencies, DAW declared 46.4ms @ 2048 samples (declared output latency 50.6ms @ 2232) in the Audio Settings panel works fine for my needs, as I don't record anything; my other problem as of late is the unavailability of output for ASIO. At times, I just wish there was an option for ASIO for take the control of audio by force. At least I'm sure it will release the control once it's turned off, while other software just remain in control of the audio driver even after they've done using it.
I can't really afford to get a proper audio interface with hardware mixing rigth now, so my attention came to M-Audio Transit, being that I can't plug my Creative card in my motherboard anymore and am forced to use onboard Realtek audio. Transit is nothing fancy, USB interface packed in a small box; line/optical in, optical and line out, meant for mobile auditing (using with a laptop). I think it would be perfect for my needs and my budget, but I can't find anywhere if it's capable of doing this internal mixing on its own (by that, I mean if it's multi-client capable). Just wondering if anyone have any insight on that?
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Post by extant09 on Jun 28, 2010 21:40:26 GMT
Well, that answers my question... thanks for the well thought out responses. Some people need to actually read the thread before posting.
Must be all ASIO drivers, not just emulators. I was having this issue prior with the default driver that came with my ECHO audiofire 4, even before installing asio4all.
It doesn't really help those that want to listen to youtube etc; but using your DAW as a media player (instead of running WMP/winamp at the same time) is an easy option if you are recording and want something to play along to. This way you can still hear yourself as well if you have monitoring on.
Just the price to be payed for low latency I think.
Cheers for the driver!
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Post by gyrocog on Jul 15, 2010 19:07:34 GMT
For me, using ASIO seems like more than just low latency. As I stated previously, I don't have any need for <10ms latencies, but without ASIO, my DAW just seems sluggish, like it's dragging down the overall feel and performance of the audio software. It's just slow without it, and I can't make it to work most of the times because it won't take over the audio resources, so whatever application used audio previously, I have to shut down completely, or worse - reboot entire computer because ASIO keeps reporting outputs as unavailable. It's really frustrating. If ASIO4ALL would take control of the audio resources by force, at least it would be easy to release that control once I turn off my DAW (and ASIO driver with it), instead of turning off half of dozen of applications that have used sound previously, even if they haven't made a beep for hours and hours. Frankly, I'd be very happy with either of two options: 1. If Windows would allow me to remove applications from the mixer, even if I had to do it manually 2. If ASIO4All would acquire the audio resources by force.
That would solve all my major problems I have right now. The minor ones would be not being able to hear multiple sources, but I guess it's the price for low-cost audio, such as on-board Realtek.
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Post by gyrocog on Jul 22, 2010 19:55:14 GMT
Well, I think I found a small workaround to my problem with messengers. As I wrote before, whenever they make any sound (contacts going on/offline, or new messages/emails arrived), it would occupy the audio resources, and ASIO4ALL reports outputs as unavailable, because of the now well-known problem with Vista/7+Realtek combination. The real problem is that applications won't relinquish the resources even if they haven't used it in a long period of time. A few hours of no sound whatsoever, but the application is still listen in the Windows Mixer panel. So, I noticed that when that happens, all I have to do is play something, like an mp3 file or a movie or anything that makes sound. Once I turn that off, the audio resource is clear for use again, and ASIO4ALL works again.
Hope that helps for some of you at least.
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Post by taylercfi on Sept 28, 2010 8:49:35 GMT
Well... not to beat a dead horse, but... After intalling ASIO4ALL, and doing everything I can think of, followed all the advice, and still can't get sound from Adobe Premiere CS3. I'm getting sound in every other application, can play all my video files and audio files, in all file formats, but not a sound out of Adobe Premiere CS3. (Yes, I visited the Adobe site and did all the stuff they said as well.) ASIO4ALL says that either the MS GS Wavetable Synth is isn't enabled (which it is), or that something else is using the sound system. But what? And you'll notice from the screen shot that it isn't recognizing my mic input either, and the mic is working fine. It says that something else is already working, but I don't know what.
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Post by Michael Tippach on Sept 29, 2010 16:41:27 GMT
And you'll notice from the screen shot that it isn't recognizing my mic input either, and the mic is working fine. In the Windows sound options, have you enabled "Listen to this device" for the Mic, per any chance? Because if so, both the Mic and the audio output will be used by the OS in a softwere audio loop and hence unavailable for ASIO4ALL. Other suspects woul be e.g. a soft phone or PIM application.
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Post by comike on Oct 10, 2010 12:53:35 GMT
I've managed to use my audio player (foobar2000) to work while I play the battery through Chainer. To do so, I'm using the fantastic JACK (open source audio router) instead of the proposed VAC (Virtual Audio Cable, proprietary software). Once JACK in installed, it appears as an ASIO device named JackRouter. You select this in both your ASIO application (in my case, Chainer) and on your media player (you need one that supports ASIO output, or one that has an available ASIO output plugin, like foobar2000). Then, on the JACK control panel, you select "portaudio" as your driver, "jackd -S" as your JACK server, and select "ASIO::ASIO4ALL v2" as your interface. If there's enough interest, I can post some screenshots detailing the process.
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Post by Alessandro on Oct 17, 2010 15:29:31 GMT
Please, post a tutorial about this subject!!!
Thxx!!
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Post by JohnnyRock on Dec 4, 2010 14:36:15 GMT
Hi, I have the same issue on my Dell Vostro 1700 and Vista. I would like to use an M-Audio Ozone mini-keyboard attached via USB at the same time as at least one other audio app such as WinAmp, audio from YouTube, and so on. I am using MiniHost with LightBagII VST plugin to test the keyboard/latency. Without asio4all, the USB keyboard is unusable with ~1sec latency. With asio4all, the keyboard-to-sound latency is very low, but no other audio apps work, just as reported in this thread. I tried asiomulti, but so far have not gotten it to work at all. I also tried Jack, with mixed results. Using the 'Interface' setting of '(default)' does get both the keyboard and WinAmp working at the same time, but latency is noticeable, ~200msec. Using the 'Interface' setting of 'ASIO::ASIO4ALL v2' does start up asio4all, but there is no output. (Note that this setting is not in the pulldown list of 'Interfaces'. It must be typed in manually. Also note that I had to run the Jack control dialog manually with the command qjackctl). comike, a tutorial would be most appreciated! There are a lot of things that might not be set up right, such as the Connect/Patchbay dialogs in 'Jack'.
I understand the reasoning for asio4all to be limited to a single device with no mixing capability. But if there is one essential feature missing, it is a mixer. I would definitely vote for adding a mixing capability to asio4all. Using asiomulti or Jack in combination with asio4all is confusing at best. Obviously, a lot of us are having this same issue.
It is truely sad and so frustrating to have such awesome computing machines capable of executing billions of instructions per second literally in our laps, yet I still can't get even simple things to work, like a keyboard to trigger a sound without audible latency. This is unquestionably Microsoft's fault. Thanks for nothing, Bill (Gates), except a lifetime of miserable pathetic broken proprietary obfuscated confusing software.
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Post by supdoc on Dec 5, 2010 19:31:45 GMT
I think Its microsoft downrading from Windows XP, which support multi-mixing, If the OS is the only thing changed, you can be sure about that..
It's a shame there is no "full duplex" support in windows 7..
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Post by JohnnyRock on Dec 6, 2010 7:41:54 GMT
As a followup, I found something that worked on my laptop, using the M-Audio ASIO driver for the Ozone. Even this is a bit quirky though - I have to run the MiniHost VST app before any other audio apps, and I also had to increase the size of the sample buffer setting to 1024 samples in the Ozone control panel. Latency is unnoticeable for the time from key press to sound. I know this won't be of help to anyone who doesn't have an M-Audio keyboard, but I'm posting it because I think it shows that it should be possible to add the mixing capability to ASIO4ALL and still have acceptable performance.
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Post by shinobizx on Jan 8, 2011 0:44:49 GMT
the asiomulti driver approach sounds like a perfect solution, I have used guitar rig through it and it works and looks like it might be a good solution, but guitar pro 6 won't use anything but the directsound options. is there anyway to force guitar pro to use the asioserver?
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Post by Bay Nihayet on May 2, 2011 3:32:14 GMT
Guys HELLOOOO..
Just find a solutioni you dont need an extra sound card or anything. ALSO You dont need ASIO4DAMN! too...
searched everywhere than i found what we are wrong about. thats simple idea " do we realy need ASIO??
i have REALTEK HC AUDIO.
there it is,
1- Make sure "Line in" DISABLED on windows playback devices 2- Make sure "Sterio Mixing" ENABLED at same place. 3- Open guitar rig(i have GR4) Audio and midi devices(OFC) Choose Driver WASAPI (shared mode)
then device gonna be REALTEK HIGH DEFINITION AUDIO bla bla...
cross ur fingers
thats it, you hear both sounds, Guitar rig + any other windows sound.
with only 30.2 ms i have , not so bad...
and sound is better than ASIO4FckSake opion.
any questions?
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Post by jedbeetle on May 25, 2011 17:49:08 GMT
I'd just like to chime in here - I don't know if it is the fault of ASIO4ALL, but my experience with Windows 7 and audio applications has been a mixed bag of frustration. I've been using various soundblaster cards for a long time, have experienced minimal latency with a multitude of audio applications open at once in Windows XP. Things seem perfectly peachy. Life is good, if a bit slow at times.
I buy a new machine with Windows 7, i7, 8 gb of RAM, have an M-Audio card plugged in and everything, and for the first time I am forced to seek out ASIO drivers due to latency. And now life is hell, for the reasons bandied about in this thread: I open firefox and it robs audio from cubase. I open winamp, it robs audio from everything else. I spend 30 minutes trying to figure out why Cubase cannot access my audio outputs. SOMETHING is HORRIBLY WRONG here. I am scouring the internet for answers, and the "solutions" presented seem far more complex than they aught to be.
I can only blame Microsoft, honestly. They messed something up between windows XP and Vista, and haven't taken responsibility for it. What was it?! Can someone explain this to me?! I'm pretty fed up with the issue. The amount of time it takes me to convince one program to use my audio outputs is downright offensive.
I hope there is a solution found for this. And I hope whoever is responsible for this terrible oversight is taken to task and fired from wherever they work.
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Post by Vadym on Jun 1, 2011 10:24:14 GMT
Yes, man. I'd appreciate the possibility to have both firefox/WMplayer/AdobeReader (yesss, it robs my sound too) and some vst host that NEEDS asio4all to run at low latencies. For instance I'd like to practice my drums (drumkit from hell in toontrack solo) while listening to song. It's possible only using a DAW (f.e. REAPER with two tracks: one for audio song and second for vst drummer). But I'd like to have it more naturally (toontrack solo + WMplayer). I know that it seems impossible on my not so expensive laptop, but I would like to have it without using doubty linux software called Jack (which I like, but it always results very hard to manage and to understand). And, by the way, Michael Tippach (yes, sir admin, you )... the idea of forcing to use ASIO driver is great! You should do this as soon as possible. People are waiting, and I'm among of them. Instead of listening to "imaginary" sound from already closed applications I prefer ASIO4ALL takes full control of the situation because sometimes it's annoying. I really don't have nothing opened, so why my asio4all driver tells me that the device is busy? P.S. Thanks a lot for the great solution!
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